Hey guys,
By now, we’re sure you’re aware of what happened yesterday/late Monday night, and we’re sorry we weren’t able to comment until now, but we didn’t want to address the issue without taking a day to regroup and discuss our options in dealing with this unfortunate situation. Thanks for your patience in that regard.
Obviously, we’re incredibly disappointed with what happened. We understand that records leak constantly and that it’s almost entirely unavoidable nowadays, but we never thought we’d have to deal with a record leaking three months before it’s release date, and certainly never thought we’d have to deal with a leak before anyone in the band had even gotten a master reference of the record, or before the artwork for the booklet had even been completed. We’re also disappointed that you’re hearing the record for the first time, watermarked, with a Vagrant Records voiceover over every song. And we’re disappointed that the leak has thrown a massive and immovable wrench into the efforts that many people have made to prepare for the three months leading up to release. That said, what’s done is done, and we’re moving forward.
“Beggars” will be available for download, legally and voiceover free–the way it was intended to be heard–as soon as we can possibly make it happen. Leaks happen overnight. Changing an entire retail marketing plan doesn’t.
Finally, we’d like to thank those of you who have resisted the urge to download this leak, those of you who have been supportive of us in online forums as this thing began to spread yesterday, and those of you who have heard the record and are sharing kind words about it. We always appreciate your support, but even more so right now.
-Thrice
i honestly think people are intolarable about the fact that other people downloaded the leak. im one of the others but i love the album i listened to it for 3 days straight. nothing like i expected but way better. i will totally buy the hard copy, which in fact was my intention in the first place. i also have yet to get the IoS on hard copy; cant find it in store these days
hope all goes well with the baby teppei
Wow, I’ll wait to hear the album when it comes out, but man I’m tempted to download it, I’m sure it’s gonna be great. Thanks Thrice for the amazing music.
@ benji
Another great response. Again, you’ve really posted nothing that can be called an argument. You repeatedly call me a “lil girl”, but your post doesn’t contain much other substance. If you or anyone else could give me some reasons explaining why listening to the leak wasn’t piracy, then I could accept that. The reality is that everyone who posts about listening to the leak is apologetic, and that is because they know they are doing something wrong. I understand that you are getting frustrated and that you want to stop responding, but that’s really not how to end an argument. Just try to think about why you’re getting frustrated. Is it because I’m not being reasonable? No. It’s because you don’t really have an answer for someone who is calling you out on your misguided beliefs. You can say you don’t support piracy, but the evidence clearly shows that you do if you listened to the leak in any form. It is wrong, illegal, and disrespectful. Just because you did it and you “don’t really care about leaks”, it doesn’t mean that you are in any way justified. I know that right now leaks are an inevitable part of the music industry, but the people who leak albums wouldn’t be a problem if people showed some respect and class and didn’t download the albums that were leaked.
Sorry to hear this. :\
Well there is a guy posting all the songs on youtube. http://www.youtube.com/begg4rs. The album sounds great! Im definitly gonna buy it.
Heres the thing your looking for an argument, and in all honesty this is not the place to do it. I dont really care what you think and if you do think your some great debater thats fine. Your trying to prove a point, im not. I listened to the leak i loved it. Im more frustrated cuz i hate people like you. Even if i conceded and said “yeah, nick your right” where does that get us??? Im not even really trying to prove a point, Thrice is my favorite band i heard the leak. I dont going looking for leaks. And i do download off limewire. If i hear about a band i download a few songs, i like em ill go buy a cd. If they suck i delete em and move on. I never heard of pedro the lion till i saw dustin’s accoustic show. I downloaded a few songs, really liked them went out and bought achilles heel and control, which i highly recommend. I wont lie, you seem to be an intelligent guy, but you still do act like a li girl. So you can judge me, but your still no better than me.
Im not trying to be your friend, i really dont like you from your post, but i dont see this going anywhere. So im sure your gunna reply to this and though i say i wont reply back i prob will, but baby you cant dance if theres no floor
@jake… why the hell would you post the leak on their own website.
HEY GUYS. I AM A LONG TIME FAN AND HAVE LITERALLY GROWN UP LISTENING TO YOUR BEAUTIFUL MUSIC. I RECENTLY RETURNED FROM A TRIP AND WITH THE INTENT TO UPDATE MY SELF ON THRICE NEWS READ THIS POSTING FROM LAST WEEK. I SUPPORT THIS BAND. WHAT THE CORE OF THE BAND HAS BECOME, WHAT YOU GUYS BELIEVE IN, AND THERE ARE MULTITUDES OF US. I PERSONALLY AM WAITING UNTIL OCTOBER, AS I HAVE BEEN SO EXCITED ABOUT, SO I CAN GET UP EARLY, HEAD DOWN TO THE RECORD STORE AND PICK UP MY HARD COPY OF BEGGARS. I REFUSE TO HEAR WHATEVER HAS BEEN LEAKED OUT OF RESPECT FOR WHAT YOU GUYS DEDICATE YOUR LIVES TO AND FOR MYSELF AS I HAVE BEEN SO EXCITED EVERY STEP OF THIS PROCESS. REGARDLESS OF WHO KNOWS OF THIS LEAK OR NOT. HAVE SOME RESPECT GUYS FOR THE DIGNITY AND PEACE THAT THIS FANTASTICALLY GENIUS BAND HAS MAINTAINED IN THIS TIME. TRUE FANS OF THIS ART FORM AND THE EFFORT PUT FORTH DAILY FOR MONTHS AND MONTHS SHOULD KNOW THAT IT IS ONLY JUST TO BE PATIENT AND BE ABLE TO HEAR BEGGARS FOR THE FIRST TIME AS IT’S ARTISTS MEANT IT. THANK YOU DUSTIN, TEPPEI, RILEY, ED FOR YOUR DIGNITY AND HONESTY. YOU GUYS ARE INSPIRING TO THE VERY CORE. I LOOK FORWARD TO AN EPIC WARPED TOUR SAN DIEGO SHOW WHERE I AM SURE I YOU ALL WILL INSPIRE AS YOU NEVER FAIL TO DO.
Benji & Nick. Just stop. There are other places on the Internet to have your discussion. I don’t think here is appropriate. You’re not even talking about the band or the record anymore.
Indeed, honestly it have been too difficult not to download the cd, but i’ll do to show my support for thrice, if i were in the same like them it will too frustrating to live things like that.
Another thing that i realize was that besides thrice is a GREAT band, do beautiful music and i group with them, was that this is what they do FOR LIVING, so until aug 11th. Tough test
thrice fan since 2002-for life
you got it michael… i kinda realized that.
my bad holmes
It’s cool, Benji.
So, I picked up a copy of Vheissu w/the liner notes. I was thinking of typing them up to post on thelostcontinent. I read somewhere–probably here–that someone wanted them posted.
I hope to have them posted in the next day or so. They’re pretty interesting. I learned some stuff about the songs I wasn’t aware of before.
I’m just curious what the bonus content is gunna be… i wouldnt doubt if that got leaked too
sorry to hear it, cant imagine what its like knowing all the work u put in to something is stolen, i will buy my copy no worries. u guys are an inspiration, and thanks for what u guys do. by the way the song or two i listen to are outstanding.
take care.
Greg
So here’s the deal. I listened to the album, and it’s phenomenal. period. BUT i will by the hard copy out of respect for four talented musician’s hard work. Hopefully you don’t want to burn me at stake :O
i have downloaded, i admit. i have listened, and really liked it. i will not delete. but, what’s the deal? i’m a nerd too
and really want the hardcopy including artwork, just like all the other thrice-cd’s i have got.
kill me quickly??
I still have yet to hear the album, and wasn’t actually aware of the leak at all. I did however grab the Vagrant pack for GH, and have played “Mad” a number of times now and love it. I’ll definitely get Beggars online when it goes on sale, and get a hardcopy when it comes out, and I suggest you all do the same if you really want to hear the album before it’s officially released in October. Stoked on this.
All the world is mad…. man, this sucks bad. I must admit I listened to the songs on youtube, I loved the record and I hate it being leaked but there’s not much you could do about it these days. I hope you can make it out through this. I will totally buy my copy when the record hits the stores.
God bless
Sorry to hear about this…. I for one will be getting the hard copy,so that means ill be waiting for the real release date for you guys.
i did download the record.. just to see what you guys did this time.. and it’s fucking awesome.. i know what it feels like to have your 3 month work be worthless i play in a band here in mexico called Insite and that happend to us.. the difference with me is that i still buy records so you’ll have my support on that.. good luck!! see you at the warped tour in san diego!
@ benji
Seriously? You’re not trying to prove a point? So what up with all these posts with people saying they are justified when they illegally download a leak? You cant just say that you don’t want to talk about it when you obviously don’t mind talking about it as long as no one points out the flaws in your logic. The reasoning that you and other pirates use makes zero sense, and all of a sudden you don’t want to talk about it when someone calls you out. Your posts show that you obviously know that the leak is an issue for the band, as you call people out on posting youtubes of the songs. Again, just because something is online and easily stolen, that doesn’t mean that you in any way have ANY sort of justification for taking it. Your repeated label of “lil girl” for me doesn’t strengthen your position at all. If anything, it shows everyone how immature you really are.
These posts aren’t meant to be aimed directly at you either. You’re just brave enough to respond even though you don’t really have an argument or any justification for your actions. Hopefully anyone who pirated and reads this will realize how ridiculous their actions are, and not participate in the future. Leaks are only an issue because “fans” like you make it an issue.
No one here who is a regular responder on this board has yet to justify listening to the leak.
Given reasons for it? Sure. Despite what you insist Nick, the world isn’t black and white. We were waiting, we saw a chance to listen, and instead of holding back we fell for it.
I’ve apologized to the band, and as far as I’m concerned, they’re the only ones the situation needs to be taken up with.
Your logic, by the way, is insanely flawed. Your assumption is that everyone who listens to Thrice is a hardcore fan. A “true” fan, as they seem to call themselves, wouldn’t have uploaded the leak in the first place. True or not?
Let’s say, for crazy people’s sakes, that I’m right. Well, if there’s one then there must be more. I mean, that’s why leaking and pirating is as big as it is now. Anyone who actually and truly enjoys a band buys the record, right? And the rest, who listen to everything, download whatever comes out. This is the target audience of leaks: the download for the sake of listening to music, not THRICE’s music. And it’s people who pirate on a daily basis.
Let’s say, once more, I’m right. Well, why are you here? Why don’t you harass the sources of these leaks, and the spreaders? Demonoid or Pirate Bay or it leaked or whatever these sites are called. You choose, instead, to come to the band’s website to argue with what you arrogantly call “”fans,”" in an attempt to suggest some fake loyalty, when all you’ve done is established yourself not as any form of voice of reason, but as the inveitable extremist: the egotistical, my-way-or-the-highway attitude toting fellow who comes to interject his opinion into a mix where it was never asked or needed.
That being said, those of us here who listened to the leak are big boys and girls and understood the consequences of our actions. You are not God, and you’re certainly not Thrice, so you’re judgment is not only null and void but completely without logic. There is, to say, nothing at all to gain by sitting here attempting to make people feel bad for listening to their favorite band early except your own personal satisfaction that you just “know” what’s right, and by everything holy, if it’s not your book your shoving down our throats, its your fist.
What it comes down to is this: benji, the other listeners, and I? We can make it up. We can not just buy the album but buy more as gifts for people and spread the word. But you? You can’t make up for trying to humiliate your fellow man. You can’t make up for asserting yourself as judge, jury, and executioner when the victims themselves have already forgiven, forgotten, and moved on…and are, in fact, now happier that we can listen to this album sooner on iTunes.
No, this isn’t about Thrice or the leak…it’s about you. You argue that benji is immature for his calling you a “lil girl,” but your sole reason for returning to this forum after a week of this is…and here’s the kicker…
to continue fighting and continue arguing and continue asserting yourself as the leader of morality, no matter if you’re criticizing or insulting someone.
My advice Benji? Ignore this character. He is, honestly, borderline troll–that is, only replying to say something directly meant to incite controversy, anger, etc. And its these conversations, I think, that keep the band from chiming in in the forums like they used to.
I just want this excitement to go away, so those of us who are here every day get back to our normal conversations on the lyrics, the music, and the meanings. Because that’s what we’re here for. And if that make me one of your “fans” Nick, then I wouldn’t have it any other way.
Cheers.
Im away ahead of you Vince.
*Way ahead of you
@ Vince
Again, the argument of the pirate boils down to “STOP JUDGING ME”, or “YOU’RE A JERK/TROLL”. Buying another copy of the album later on in no way rectifies your actions when you download illegally. You also try to justify it by saying that fans are happier because they get to download the iTunes version earlier? The only reason that happened is because the band got screwed over because a bunch of people downloaded the leak. An earlier online release is not good news for the band, it’s just good news for you.
Also, what’s up with the shoving books down people’s throats remark? Are you insinuating that I’m a bible thumper? Just because I have an issues with the logic that pirates use to justify their actions doesn’t mean anything except that I have a problem with them. How is this about my personal self satisfaction when you guys are the ones who couldn’t wait or didn’t bother to think about how their actions would affect their favorite band? I never said anyone needed to apologize to me, that would be ridiculous. But how is coming on here and “apologizing” while at the same time obviously not feeling any remorse for the band in any way sincere? I haven’t done anything illegal, you guys have. If you really, truly thought about the consequences of your actions before you downloaded, then why did you do it anyways?
Again, no one can present any sort of argument that doesn’t involve directly attacking me. My point is that if no one had downloaded the leak, none of this would be an issue. The people who leaked it are as much to blame as you guys. The reason I am persistent here is because people here seem to think that their actions aren’t hurtful to the band, or that it doesn’t make enough of an impact to justify not pirating. You just want this excitement to go away? Maybe you should have thought about the consequences of your actions before you pirated. Oh wait, you did. Go back to your conversations about the lyrics and meanings of songs that you stole. Ignore the person who calls you out because you don’t have any real sort of response for him.
Stay classy.
The fact of the matter is that regardless of how many people listened to the leak, the release date would have been pushed forwards anyway. It doesn’t matter if a hundred people listened to it or ten thousand – it was still out there and needed to be dealt with. The people who should be blamed are the ones who leaked it in the first place. Does that excuse those of us who listened to it? No, it was illegal. But nonetheless arguing with indivdual fans who are gonna buy the record anyway is an utterly pointless thing to do. All that does is take the heat off the people who ARE responsible for the release date having to be changed.
How does discussing this take the heat off of the person who first leaked it? As far as anyone knows, that person isn’t getting any heat anyways, as they probably aren’t publicly talking about their actions. My main issue is with the people on these boards that do. It’s almost worse to be on here talking about how you downloaded it and acting like nothings wrong. Downloading a leak might be less detrimental than actually leaking, but it is still a horrible thing to do to a band, especially one that really means something to you.
I would be bringing this up and communicating with the people who originally leaked, but they’re smart enough to not gloat about their actions. Just because you weren’t the ringleader of this circus, that doesn’t mean that you’re immune to anything. You all just wanna get together and talk about the new album? The only reason you’re able to talk about the lyrics or meanings of the new songs is because you stole. How is that something that you want to publicly admit on a message board?
For the record, I’m not trying to justify downloading the leak. That’s an equally pointless thing to do since it’s something that is never gonna be agreed on. You have your view on it, and everyone else has theirs. That’s fine.
I was responding to you stating “you also try to justify it by saying that fans are happier because they get to download the iTunes version earlier? The only reason that happened is because the band got screwed over because a bunch of people downloaded the leak.” That’s not a matter of opinion, it’s just blatantly not true because of the reasons I said before.
You might not be trying to justify it, but several others have. How is the part you quoted not true? If no one had downloaded the leak, nothing would have happened. I have a problem with the mindset of “I bet other people are going to steal this, so that makes it okay if I do it too.” If the leak had been minor and contained, I doubt they would have had to change the release date. Since the leak was so huge, they had no choice but to scrap their release plans if they wanted to salvage their record. The people who leaked originally might have started it, but downloaders continued the chain that led to the damage that was done. I really have a hard time understanding why this is so hard to work out. Just because there was some mob mentality going on, that doesn’t mean that talking about your actions on the bands own website is anywhere close to the right thing to do.
Every leak ends up being huge. There’s very little that can be done to stop it, and again, the blame for that lies with the uploaders.
The reason the release date was brought forward was because people COULD listen to it. It didn’t matter how many actually had done. The fact was that the record was available three months early to anyone with a basic knowledge of how to find it, and something had to be done for that reason alone – not because of the theoretical number of people who were listening to it.
Anyway, it’s clear that we’re not gonna see eye to eye on this, so let’s just agree to disagree, and move on eh
Nick, seriously…stop complaining. I didn’t insult you, I only commented on what you presented me. Apparently you don’t do your research, and considering you’re sitting here arguing so heatedly about this, I just assumed you followed Thrice enough to know their twitter says “Despite all this I’m glad you guys can hear the record earlier on iTunes! DK” To me, it’s leaning more, again to the troll-like behavior: you don’t really care for the band, you’re just here to argue.
The number of folks here who downloaded the leak are in a small percentage. You need to factor those in from AP, it leaked, etc. etc. who never commented on this board. There are a good deal of people who commented here who have said they’ll wait. There are also a decent size that said they’ve heard it. But nowhere near the overall amount. I followed this since it first happened, and was devestated to hear it had. This should not have happened. I would have expected it a week or a few days before release…but three months? Then we watched it slowly move from one unknown source to a single out-there website, then to random forums you could google search, and finally to the major leaking sites, where it met like poison in the water supply. I sat there hoping it would’ve been contained, but it couldn’t. There are people who think having the music and posting it is somehow an affirmation of themselves. Whatever. But don’t sit there and characterize me as some petty thief. I listened because, unfortunately, I was blinded by passion. And I massively regret this happening, and wish it hadn’t, because these guys are the best. And that’s exactly why I listened to it….because, well, they’re too good to wait for, and that was my impatience. Maybe even jealousy that all this random people were listening to it, and I couldn’t. Whatever, that’s my deal to work out, but am I glad on a level that I could? Yea, because right after it had leaked, I think the good feedback alleviated the worry a bit. Note, I never said I could fix what I’ve done…but yes, one can make up for it.
What I don’t get is why you’re still here. What do you aim to achieve by this? I mean the only apparent desired conclusion to any of your speeches involves us begging for your forgiveness, giving up our satanic ways, and probably setting ourselves on fire for good measure. I mean honestly, what would push a man to sit here and degrade their fellow men and woman about something they already feel bad about? Me? I would have come in here to play voice of reason/peacekeeper. “Hey guys, look, I know this happened and it’s made this come out early and plenty of folks are listening to it, but try and not if you can, it’s not good for the band and you should really just wait. For yourselves and them.” But you? It’s about bringing down the human being, for you, instead of supporting them and trying to incite better behavior.
It doesn’t matter, really. I’m over it, and over spamming this board with this ridiculous arguement.
Hsve a good one.
Again Vince, your argument boils down to attacks on me and my character, and not my argument. The reason why I am being so persistent is I hate it when stuff like this happens, and I want it to never happen again. How are you above the actions that you are calling me out on, when you post things like “you don’t really care for the band, you’re just here to argue”?
I agree that a large portion of the blame should be put on the original leakers, but again, the leaks wouldn’t mean anything if people didn’t take it. I’m not going to sit here and post “supportive” messages when stealing is clearly the wrong thing to do. How is the supportive message that you posted supposed to change anyone’s mind? That kind of thing has been posted several times, but lots people blatantly ignore it. I’m not trying to just call out fans from this board who stole, it’s just that people on this board have the worst attitude about it because of what they posted. How can you say that you have a problem with the leak and that you were “devastated” when you still downloaded? If you downloaded YOU ARE PART OF THE PROBLEM. Sure, other people are to blame as well, but that doesn’t excuse you from anything. Of course I’m trying to get you to see how ridiculous your actions are and change your ways. If you cared about how much a leak hurts the band, then you would. What’s done is done, and a leak can’t be undone, but you can change your behavior in the future.
Downloading a leak doesn’t help anyone but yourself, it validates the leaker, and it really hurts the band. You obviously have the mindset that would allow you to steal again, so how is that okay? I’m sure that you, and others, would be “blinded by passion” again the next time something leaked. The argument that “every leak ends up being huge” doesn’t make any sense. It only ends up being huge because everyone thinks like that. If you don’t download it, it won’t have as much of an impact. Just because the band is posting messages about how they’re happy that we get to hear the music sooner, it doesn’t mean that it’s not a horrible thing for them to go through. You’re in no way “supporting the band” by posting positive messages about the album that you just stole. You can try to atone for your behavior by buying copies later, but that’s not the point at all. The point is that this kind of BS should never ever happen again, especially with the dedicated fan base that this band has. I’d like to be able to have faith that you guys can pull that off, but it’s discouraging when I see a bunch of posts talking about how much the leak sucks, yet how AWESOME the album is.
Lol, you just don’t get it Nick. It’s fine. You think I’m a terrible fan, and that’s fine. I’m over it.
I know where I stand with them, and that’s what matters
to me.
Take care.
I’m really not the one who doesn’t get it. You know where you stand, and so does everyone else. There really is no argument other than, “I wanted it early so I took it”. Whatever makes you feel better about yourself.
Never once denied that I was excited and listened. Regret it, but I’m still looking forward to iTunes, CD and vinyl release. There’s nothing like opening up that case and getting to smell that album freshness.
Meh, like I said, it’s blatantly obvious that we’re not going to agree on this, so to try arguing my point anymore is completely futile and a waste of my time.
I suggest therefore that you stop wasting your own time by posting overly verbose lectures that influence absolutely nobody, and find something better to do. Life’s too short.
Agreed, Matt. Such as being completely psyched about Thrice-Brand New tour dates.
The only reason that it’s not possible for us to see eye to eye right now is because you are too set in your ways to hear what someone has to say when they point out why your logic is faulty. The people who leak are horrible, but it’s really the downloaders who turn it into a huge issue. You obviously know that your actions are wrong since multiple people say they regret it, yet somehow I’m the one who’s in the wrong here? Life’s too short, so I won’t think about how my actions affect other people, I guess. My bad for trying to change that.
Stop!
Take your discussion here, or some place like it:
http://www.ethics.org.au/ethics_forum/active_topics.asp
I’m sure this sounds bossy. I don’t run this site, but this could be talked about elsewhere. Have fun.
Leaked??? How LAME. I’m waiting till I can hold the disc in my hands and read the lyrics as I listen. Every Thrice CD has been more than worth the wait.
Its fine Micheal, I really am sorry for starting this up.
NEVER WILL I STEAL A THRICE RECORD! you guys work way to hard and have such selfless motives for me to ever rip you guys off. Those who did should be ashamed.
ha nick and benji you guys make me laugh. ya i listened to it on youtube its a good. very fresh i like how every cd has its own sound and the alchemy index had 4. anyway im still buying the cd even though i could download it. not for any moral reason i just like bonus material.
haha at least somebody liked all that hub bub
I haven’t bothered to read any of those crazy-long paragraph off-topic arguments above, for one reason. Anybody who’s trying to flex their internet ego on Thrice’s website isn’t worth the time and effort to even take what they say seriously, because they’re acting like preschool kids with spellcheckers to fill their lack of intelligence. Just shut up and stop arguing, you’re both wrong anyways so get married, leave town, and never post here again. Your making the Thrice fan base look bad.
I’m really sorry to hear that your album was leaked. I guess the benefit is that the fans can buy the album a little before it was intended. I’m glad to see that you guys have handled this situation as well as possible. I look forward to hearing the next album. I’m going to buy it the day it hits the shelves (yay bonus music and lossless on CDs!) Thanks for all your hard work, and keep up the awesome music!
We’re having a heat wave, a tropical heat wave…
Almost to 500 comments!
This band makes amazing music!
there’s something we ALL can agree on!
500.